Jimmy, I stand corrected. You have some good points here. First off, I only read the paragraph that was posted in the daily report from the NIPC Watch, I did not read the law in detail, which I will now do, thank you for the URL for that. I also made error in the subject line, stating new bill being passed, that was a mistake, should have read bill being considered......however, I still feel some laws related to crimes against people need to be changed, but at least we are back on track of discussing CRIME/INFRAGARD topics. I agree, interfering with government communications is serious and the degree of punishment does need to be considered at a higher level for this. The message needs to be loud and clear with new laws, which will help prevent attacks to our infrastructure and our personal freedom. You are absolutely right, topics need to be researched further before making comment about them. Thank you. Heidi Henry A new bill being considered in Congress calls for life in prison without a possibility of parole for people who engage in computer trespass, also known as hackers. Obviously, the Anti-Terrorism Act is the direct result of the 11 September attacks, but several organizations are already crying foul over its implications. Most noticeably, the Electronic Frontier Foundation has publicly condemned the bill, saying the punishment is too severe, potentially sending "relatively harmless pranksters" to prison for life. The bill treats low-level computer intrusion, already a crime under existing laws, as an act of terrorism. (Source: East Carolinian, 12 October) -----Original Message----- From: owner-crime@/var/spool/majordomo/lists/crime [mailto:owner-crime@/var/spool/majordomo/lists/crime]On Behalf Of Kuo, Jimmy Sent: Monday, October 15, 2001 9:52 PM To: 'crime@private ' Subject: RE: new bill being passed in Congress People, please read the law before you comment! There are plenty to not like about the bill. But this interpretation is incorrect. The hacking has to be against certain govt entities. With regard to computer crime, I think the primary issues are: 1) There is to be the concept of a national warrant for chasing electronic evidence. Currently, this system is very disjoint, having to get a warrant in every jurisdiction you want to wiretap. 2) Interfering with govt communications can be treated as a crime of terrorism. This is what can yield to a lifetime sentence. In my "not a lawyer" interpretation, releasing a worm could also fall under this clause. 3) Materially aiding the above could also yield a terrorism charge. To head off the "oh no" from the full disclosure crowd, again, IANAL but our highest court has said that it was legal to publish how to create an A-bomb, but you can't make or sell the components. But here, you ought to ask your own lawyer since so much is at stake. And then there are a LOT of other things, mostly about treatment of non-citizens. The situation will have changed by November. But this is in my presentation as well. 3OCT01: PATRIOT Passed Judiciary Committee 36-0. 12OCT01: USA Act of 2001, rewritten PATRIOT, passes House 337-79, Senate 96-1. If you wish to read it yourself, it's at: http://www.house.gov/rules/sensen_028.pdf Jimmy -----Original Message----- From: Heidi To: crime@private Sent: 10/15/01 7:53 PM Subject: RE: new bill being passed in Congress "A new bill being considered in Congress calls for life in prison without a possibility of parole for people who engage in computer trespass, also known as hackers." Now isn't this great!!!! Life in prison without parole for hacking, yet pointing a loaded firearm at someone and threatening to kill them is only a misdemeanor, no jail time, just cite and release, a slap on the hand!!!! This may not be C.R.I.M.E. related but who are they kidding? Hacking into a company website may cost a lot of money, but if that guns goes off, how many life's will it cost, and in my book, this is a form of terrorism!!! Hacking into a company website digs into peoples pockets, that is the difference and where the strength comes from obviously when getting bills passed through Congress. If a guy points a loaded firearm at someone that is nothing, what about the next time when the gun goes off and kills innocent people? Obviously it does not dig into enough pockets to matter. Very sad scenario. Heidi Henry mcps@private
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