On Thu, 2002-03-07 at 10:40, Ken Nowack wrote: > So, in effect, volunteers who should actually be paid > union workers. That's even better. Heck, why don't we > just outsource it to a pakistani prison. Ya know, > prison workers are the easiest to train and control, > and cost the least. > Actually prison workers are hard to train and control. That is a silly statement. There is a difference. Police Officers (the Unioun Workers you refer to) are doing their job. They often get assistance from non-officer types. That includes volunteers, analysts, paid professionals, and others. The title "reserve officer" all the tech person to have an offical title which allows things like the city to pay for training. BTW there are a number of people who already volunteer their time to places like the police, schools, parks, etc. I don't see you raising the issues there.... > All I'm saying is this: 1. police agencies serve the > powerful, not people like me, I am sorry you see yourself as weak. Police make decisions on the fly. If those decisions favor a group *unfairly* than it needs fixing. If you want to become powerful, help the police. >2. police agencies > already have the expertise neccessary to handle tech > issues like these (hint - remember the consolidation > efforts post 9.11 combining various enforcement > agencies) This is flat out wrong. I would love to see *any* evidence to the contrary. I have met with various levels of government, from local cities, to Senator Wyden's office, and one thing that is agreed, it that police agencies *do not* have the tech to handle the issues. I am somewhat unique in the position that I don't think they need it (yet) and should use the community for help. > 3. these types of partnerships have > historically been used to give a nice looking veneer > to other more nefarious deeds Really? Name a few. Go back 400 years (that should satisfy you "historically" comment). I can think of several that have not. Helping hands comes to mind. Civilian Air Patrol. Explorers. > 4. law enforcement > issues and civil rights issues are inseperable. Yes and? Are you saying if you are for civil rights you cannot support any law enforcement issues? They effect the same space most definitely, but they are not mutually exclusive. To some extent without law enforcement you have *no* civil rights. > > If you choose to support this that's fine. Call me > reactionist, call me suspicious, call me whatever, I'm > used to it. In my experience, I'm *always* suspicious > or maneuvers like this. Nine times out of ten, theres > more going on than the nice innocent sounding > proposal. Show me the numebrs. I think you are making this up. Show me statistics, data or other evidence that even come close to this. > And nine times out of ten, it ends up making > the situation worse for those of us who aren't > powerful - aka the other 85%. > Again, demonstrate this. > --- "Shahms E. King" <shahms@private> wrote: > > On Thu, 2002-03-07 at 09:13, Ken Nowack wrote: > > > > > > That's nice and innocent sounding and all. But why > > > don't they just hire techs to do it? Why do they > > need > > > > Basically, they *are* hiring techs to do it, they > > need us because we > > *are* the techs...get it? > > And budgetary (as well as general staffing) concerns > > would keep them > > from hiring techs full time, but they need to ensure > > that the people > > they do use for this service are properly trained; > > since they aren't > > "hiring" them, they are effectively giving > > "on-the-job-training" to > > consultants and being typically bureaucratic about > > it by giving it a > > fancy name like "Police Reserve Specialist" > > > > --Shahms > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Support PLUG and the Open Source Community > > http://www.linuxfund.org/lugs/?lug=plug > > To unsubscribe from the PLUG list visit > http://www.pdxlinux.org/mailing_list/ > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email! > http://mail.yahoo.com/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Support PLUG and the Open Source Community http://www.linuxfund.org/lugs/?lug=plug > To unsubscribe from the PLUG list visit http://www.pdxlinux.org/mailing_list/ > -- Zot O'Connor http://www.ZotConsulting.com http://www.WhiteKnightHackers.com
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Sun May 26 2002 - 11:39:11 PDT