A computer science degree means little in the computer security or unix
administration fields. On the job, what really matters is whether you have the
proper skills. Headhunters (recruiters) do value a degree, however, and some
even go so far as to turn away applicants without one ("My client stated they
want an applicant with a degree."). In many cases, the type of degree does not
matter; some will accept someone with a degree in botany for a unix
administration or security position.
Telling a headhunter your skills is very dangerous. If you don't have "work
experience" (this excludes volunteering and self-education) to back up your
claims, they won't let you _near_ a senior (and quite possibly not even junior)
level position. But when it comes to entry-level positions, your skills mean
everything: if you have too many, you're overqualified, and they send you away.
Some recruiting firms will offer you packaged computerized tests in your field
(...or a similar one, by their standards). From my experience, taking these
tests is generally a bad idea. In doing so, you're asking for someone who is
completely ill versed in your field (they know media hype, and that's about it)
to evaluate you, and you will have no idea of the outcome. I once took a test
at a recruiting firm in unix administration. When i hailed the test
administrator and showed her the several errors i had found in the test up to
that point (some questions had no acceptable choice, some had two, and in
others, even the examples wouldn't work), she said "Oh, yeah, some other people
said that too," and left. At that point i got up and walked out, as i had more
important places to be.
If you're looking for your first job in a field of which you have a lot of
_practical_ experience, and you don't want to be completely bored, you may want
to try foregoing the headhunters and going for direct communication with the
employment contacts of various companies (though some will only work through
recruiting firms, unfortunately). Go to various unix or security sites and
visit the employment section. Check UGU (www.ugu.com) periodically (i.e. every
day) for honest job listings (many entries are from headhunters, but they're
generally easy to spot). And of course, weed through the postings on the
securityjobs list for ones you can actually use.
If you really must go through a headhunter despite all of this, here are some
things to keep in mind:
1. Be very careful with your resume. Some require that you state an objective,
and some (usually the more enlightened ones) will throw away any papers that
list them. You will probably want to give them your resume without an
objective first, and if they complain, resend it with the objective. Always
give them only what they need or want to know; they usually hate extraneous
information.
2. As far as skills on resumes are concerned, very few (albeit some)
headhunters are impressed by lots of skills. Most that i've seen have taken
out a pad of paper, written down my past jobs (and perhaps one or two skills),
and held that as my resume.
3. Many people who go to headhunters will be less knowledgeable than you, but
will lie on their resume. They will probably end up getting the jobs that you
are qualified for. You can live with it, or you can lie on your resume too.
When i was in this situation, i chose not to lie; i ended up getting a job
through UGU instead.
4. Keep your references handy. If a headhunter agrees to send your resume to a
client, they will not then wait around for you to send them your references if
they have others waiting as well.
5. Headhunters generally like certifications -- any of them. If you have an
MCSE, you will be much better qualified for a position relating to security or
unix, as far as many headhunters are concerned.
I'm sure (i hope) there are some headhunters who know their elbows from...
well, other body parts... as far as unix, networking, or security is concerned,
but (no offense to headhunters) most do not.
Any information held within this document is based on my experience with the
headhunting (recruiting) industry and with company employment contacts. I have
personally experienced at _least_ two cases of any incident mentioned herein
(with exception to the note about the unix administration test; i have taken
more than that one test at more than that one recruiting firm, in fact with a
very similar outcome, but that exact incident happened only once).
Please note that i am in no way trying to demean or offend headhunters. They
are as essential as apartment brokers. Take that as you will.
ari
P.S. - Whether you can expound your dabbles in "The Dark Side" at an interview
depends on who you're interviewing with. But no, you would definitely not want
to try this with a headhunter.
jasonthomasmurphyat_private said this stuff:
> I don’t know if this is the proper forum to ask or to discuss this question
> but here it goes.
>
> I am a recent graduate with a degree in Computer Information Systems
> (Computer Science Degree where a Business minor substitutes for the Math,
> Physics, and Chemistry classes) and have been looking for a job for about
> the last 6 weeks and have noticed a pattern. About every Computer Security
> job posting I read is for a Senior position. I have yet to see a Junior or
> entry level Computer Security job posting, although, I think being a Network
> Admin is a at least Junior Computer Security job.
>
> Now my question is, how do I break into (No pun intended) the Computer
> Security field? I have been following the Computer Security Scene for about
> 10 years as a hobby/passion and I never have had job in the Computer
> Security field. How do I convince job recruiter that know Computer Security?
> I can not state at a interview that I have broken into machines and have
> done some activities that would be considered illegal or at least immoral. I
> also can not prove that I have done work for other people (Helping people,
> clubs, organizations that need security help). What can I do to get
> recognized?
>
> So what should I do? Any help or recommendation of any kind would be greatly
> appreciated.
>
> ______________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : Fri Apr 13 2001 - 15:26:07 PDT