All, It's interesting hearing replies both on-line and off line regarding this topic. Some of the pessimistic replies are, which I think if I read them right, are not entirely unfounded, however I believe they lack a bit of depth. As for the rosy outlook, I think it'll come (everything is cyclic... take that Santayana [sic] paraphrase).. it'll just take some patience on everybody's behalf. I'd like to address these topics separately here. For the pessimist, yes, a lot of people were overpaid, but a number were underpaid too. It all depends on who you talked to and which industry sector and part of the country you were focusing on. The "Valley" per se had astronomical salaries, but taken in scope and context of the median income all around, these inflated salaries would still just help you pay for a shared apartment. When somebody from the "west" shoots for say the "east" (like D.C. or Atlanta), asking the same salary from what they were making in S.F. or S.J., or even L.A. may break the bank of anybody trying to hire a "pro" from the "west". In most cases, up and until the bubble had the air let out of it, companies could make that sacrifice. Now it comes down to justifying the high salary for possibly low returns. People that can command the salary that they are looking for now are either super-duper specialized professionals (say, somebody with truly 20 years of experiences in the sector) or the "Swiss Army Knife" or "Leatherman" professionals that can easily fit into any role, hence more bang for the buck in either case. Those who have weak or soft skills in any area are probably going to be the first to let go and are going to have the hardest time finding a new job. The only thing that can save those folks are if they are extremely good talkers, and mostly B.S. at that. For the sunny-side of things, I believe the market will turn around, but it won't be very quickly. We live in a greedy society (take as an example drafting high schoolers into the NBA) who values the almighty quick buck over a slow and steady progression. This is how the U.S got beat in the 80's by the Asia-Pacific countries because they valued investment (either in R&D or Real Estate.. take your pick). No one in the U.S. seems to want to go slow and steady... the desire to profitability forces too many companies to try to grow their business too fast and too unstructured. I've been party to three of those companies (including the one I'm with now). I've also been with two other companies who've been around for almost forever and still are here because they have a foundation they've built over the years.. weathering many financial and economic storms. My current company just laid off 10% of their workforce today, pressured to achieve profitability by the parent company. They were reasonable cuts, folks who where idling on lack of work, not for true lack of skills. I'm sure they may get hired back once the company gets on firmer ground, but maybe not, depending on how the market sector they are in performs. My personal bet is that they will fail because of management issues and not because of the thin market segment. On a final note and opinion, I think the market was out of whack for a period of time and it seriously pissed me off. I was at a job (my last one) where my junior got paid more than me because he came from a supposed management position. He had less than 1/8th the skills I did, and eventually (after 6 mos.) was let go. I've encountered that in a number of cases, and hope that this market shakeup will start throwing people a clue as to NOT lie or fluff their resume to get a position. If you don't have the skills, don't advertise it. This goes to recruiters who also "edit" or "clarify" applicant's resumes as well. I've been on the other end of the hiring table several times, and I have a good B.S. meter and the H.R. departments have a love/hate relationship with me. They hate the fact that out of 50+ resumes, I'll only choose to speak to 1 or 2 people. They love the fact that usually when the interviewees come in, it's that small pool that gets picked and tends to stay, shortening their work in the long run. I've always been honest on my resume, even going as far as to remove items after a time from non-use or that, I do know the topic, but I do not wished to be hired on that knowledge (Java and C/C++ in my case). I can read and debug code, but as a Systems Engineer, I don't want to be hired as a programmer at this stage in my career. The only hope is that this tightening of everybody's collective belt will allow those English and Design Majors to go back to Designing and Writing and allow the folks that intended to get and keep a technical career track (and not just jump on the latest fad) to proceed. Nothing upset me more than having to compete for a Sr. Unix Admin position with an Art student right out of the local College or University (I make one exception for CMU, since they made all the Humanities and Arts, etc. students take a computer course which DID include UNIX... so they do have a clue. I'm also not knocking folks who use Linux, *BSD, or Solaris, etc. at home and are not employed to use it in their daily job. In fact, I want to see something like that on a resume since it shows they have an interest outside the daily grind. I'll hire somebody who took the time to use RRDTool or MRTG from source over some guy who manned a tech desk for EDS any day. I just hope some of those recruiters and employers take the same position rather than trying to key into the buzzwords (and damn acronyms) and those useless pieces of paper (yes, I'm talking about stuff like the MCSE's) which are outdated as soon as you leave the classroom. Okay, thank you for all those who took the time to read my rant. I hope to hear some other perspectives on this... please! And if you'd like to talk in private or have even a job (since this is mailing list for it) by all means, feel free to contact me! Cheers! -- David A. Koran (dakat_private) - http://www.solo.net/~dak/ -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 GIT/CS/SS d- s+: a- C+++$ UBLHSX++++$ P+++$ L- E--- W+++ N- o-- K-? w--- O- M+++$ V-- PS++ PE- Y+>++ PGP t--@ 5 X+ R- tv b+ DI++++ D G e*>+++ h++ r y+ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
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